Nudism and exhibitionism

Replies

• OU

  

  outdoorguyau

  Jul 29, 2021

  In my opinion I think there often is an over lap between the two.

  For me, I am being nude for myself primarily ie it is very enjoyable, I feel exhilarated and totally free. That can be be either alone at home or outdoors at a beach with other nudists. having said that I don't mind if people see me naked at all and I suppose I kinda like that also. In other words I am nude for myself primarily and for others as a secondary motivation. Being categorised as a particular thing or type of person is my pet hate. It is not a black and white issue as we are all different. Hope that makes sense.

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• GU

  

  Guzzi27

  Jul 29, 2021

  I think there is an overlap. The two arent mutually exclusive. You have textiles that are exhibitionists, love being noticed, looked at etc etc. So why cant a naturist who just loves being naked be the same. The fact that you enjoy being noticed etc doesnt necessarily rule out the fact that you enjoy being naked just for the sake of being naked.

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• JO

  

  John

  Jul 29, 2021

  [quote] You cant be an exhibitionist and a nudist, those words mean two different things.[/quote] I guess that would depend on your definition of "nudist." Jack and Jill are both exhibitionists (in the looser sense of the term). They like to have others see them naked. They're gym rats, and they've worked hard at sculpting their bodies, and they want everybody to see the results. Jack only goes without clothes when he's around people who admire his body. He sees not point in disrobing if he's alone. He's what I would call a "social nudist." Jill likes to bee seen naked, but she'll be nude even when she's alone, because she also enjoys the comfort of not having clothes on. She's what I would simply call a "nudist."

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• CH

  

  Chris

  Jul 29, 2021

  'Nudist' and 'exhibitionist' aren't mutually exclusive. I'm somewhere around how outdoorguyau describes himself. I'm basically a nudist - I prefer not wearing clothes wherever I am... home, beach (when I'm the only one there or with others), bushwalking (alone or with others)... but there's a bit of the exhibitionist in me as well...

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• NU

  

  nudony

  Jul 30, 2021

  Let's go back to the dictionary definition of exhibitionism:Definition of exhibitionism 1a: a perversion in which sexual gratification is obtained from the indecent exposure of one's genitals (as to a stranger) b: an act of such exposure 2: the act or practice of behaving so as to attract attention to oneselfIf we go by 1a, theindecent exposure of one's genitals (as to a stranger)and nudism are incompatible. For one thing "exposing" the genitals is not indecent in a nudist context (erections notwithstanding). And even so; the "sexual gratification" part is rendered "ungratifying" by the resulting ostracization. The second definition is what can be a little more "nuanced." As a nudist, is it possible to"behave so as to attract attention to oneself"? Well: yes. But whether the intent of such "behavior" is to attract attention is the question. Some people are naturally outgoing and/or confident; which may attract attention. But that's not exhibitionism. There has to be "intent to attract attention" for the behavior to be exhibitionistic. Which is possible; but not a good way to gain acceptance in nudist circles.

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• GU

  

  Guzzi27

  Jul 30, 2021

  [quote]Let's go back to the dictionary definition of exhibitionism: Definition of exhibitionism 1a: a perversion in which sexual gratification is obtained from the indecent exposure of one's genitals (as to a stranger) b: an act of such exposure 2: the act or practice of behaving so as to attract attention to oneself If we go by 1a, the indecent exposure of one's genitals (as to a stranger) and nudism are incompatible. For one thing "exposing" the genitals is not indecent in a nudist context (erections notwithstanding). And even so; the "sexual gratification" part is rendered "ungratifying" by the resulting ostracization. The second definition is what can be a little more "nuanced." As a nudist, is it possible to "behave so as to attract attention to oneself"? Well: yes. But whether the intent of such "behavior" is to attract attention is the question. Some people are naturally outgoing and/or confident; which may attract attention. But that's not exhibitionism. There has to be "intent to attract attention" for the behavior to be exhibitionistic. Which is possible; but not a good way to gain acceptance in nudist circles.[/quote] Scanning multiple dictionary definitions of exhibitionist only about half of them mention the sexual element and desire to expose their genitals etc. And less than half of those place that definition at the top of the list. The common thread, and one that is often at the top of the list, is a desire to draw attention to oneself. And surely that is a behaviour that exists in some people whether nudist or textile. Arguably it could be applied to nudists who have tattoos, body piercings, genital piercings/jewellery etc. They do it because they think it looks good, feels good or whatever, but they also know it will attract attention even if it is just a quick second look. They are obviously at least comfortable with that attention and might even enjoy it. Are they exhibitionists and therefore by some peoples standards not naturists. Why do we have to categorise/pigeon hole people all the time? I would question whether someone who gets sexual gratification out of being naked is a genuine naturist, but that doesnt include all (most?) exhibitionists.

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• GU

  

  Guzzi27

  Jul 30, 2021

  [quote]Why do we have to pigeonhole people? You make it sound like a bad thing, This is a site for nudists not skydivers. Skydivers have their own website, so they pigeonhole to that site.[/quote] There again there are naked skydivers!

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• JO

  

  John

  Jul 30, 2021

  Well, there are naked divers, naked surfers, and naked boardsailers. Whey not skydivers?

  I haven't heard of any naked hang glider pilots, although there are a few who fly Torrey Pines and strip down when they land on Black's Beach.

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• GU

  

  Guzzi27

  Jul 30, 2021

  [quote]Really? Where did you see that?[/quote] Google it , you will find quite a few. After all naturism is about living your life naked, or as much as possible, so why not? As naturists we do things naked that others do wearing clothes.

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• OU

  

  outdoorguyau

  Jul 31, 2021

  So by the previous definition everyone that loads a pic in Chat and all people on cam on this site are exhibitionists. What other reason could they possibly want to post a full frontal nude pic of themselves to the entire Chat community. Likewise why would a person sit in front of their cam fully naked and let people view their every move.

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• MA

  

  Marcus

  Jul 31, 2021

  I want to bring in an idea from Marc-Alain Descamps: He said if somebody is naked in front of people with clothing on he is subconsciously an exihibtionist. If all are naked there would be a subconscious neutralization and it would be nudism.

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• MA

  

  Marcus

  Aug 1, 2021

  Yes on the first hand it's the intent. I totally agree on point 2. We are nudists or even naturists and we try to have a situation as non sexual as possible. So exhibitionism or voyeurism is not allowed. But there is our subconscious and this is something we should be aware of.

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• JO

  

  John

  Aug 2, 2021

  Marcus wrote: [quote]I want to bring in an idea from Marc-Alain Descamps: He said if somebody is naked in front of people with clothing on he is subconsciously an exihibtionist. If all are naked there would be a subconscious neutralization and it would be nudism.[/quote] So if I'm on a hike by myself, minding my own business and being nude, and three clothed people walk by and see me, do I automatically become an exhibitionist? Am I an exhibitionist simply because I started the hike with the understanding that I might expect to encounter a clothed hiker now and then? I will freely grant you that there are nudists who are exhibitionists. There are nudists who are Catholics. There are nudists who are Libertarian. As long as they respect boundaries, I don't care what goes on in their minds.

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• MA

  

  Marcus

  Aug 2, 2021

  [quote] So if I'm on a hike by myself, minding my own business and being nude, and three clothed people walk by and see me, do I automatically become an exhibitionist? Am I an exhibitionist simply because I started the hike with the understanding that I might expect to encounter a clothed hiker now and then? [/quote] My point is if you are hiking in the nude and three textiles walk by (accidently, it was not your intent) and see you it feels subconsciously that you are an exhibitionist and they are voyeurists, they feel it you feel it.

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• GU

  

  Guzzi27

  Aug 3, 2021

  Why is the thread almost totally obsessed with the definition of exhibitionism as being sexually related? In many dictionaries it isnt even mentioned, the common definition is along the lines of people who like drawing attention to themselves, making an exhibit of themselves, seeking attention etc.
  I have a couple of textile friends who are total exhibitionists, flamboyant and live for being the centre of attention. They would be horrified if it was suggested there was a sexual motivation behind their behaviour? Why couldnt a naturist have a similar personality, enjoy/seek the attention in the same way a textile exhibitionist does but not be doing it for sexual reasons.

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• MA

  

  Marcus

  Aug 4, 2021

  [quote]Why is the thread almost totally obsessed with the definition of exhibitionism as being sexually related? In many dictionaries it isnt even mentioned, the common definition is along the lines of people who like drawing attention to themselves, making an exhibit of themselves, seeking attention etc. I have a couple of textile friends who are total exhibitionists, flamboyant and live for being the centre of attention. They would be horrified if it was suggested there was a sexual motivation behind their behaviour? Why couldnt a naturist have a similar personality, enjoy/seek the attention in the same way a textile exhibitionist does but not be doing it for sexual reasons.[/quote] That's right, I agree. I have the feeling we are using here the definition of Wikipedia.

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• JO

  

  John

  Aug 4, 2021

  I have the greatest respect for the OED, and would resort to it without hesitation if I were writing an academic paper on the subject. But language has a way of slipping past the dictionary definitions, and I think that "exhibitionism" is one of those words that have taken on auxiliary meanings in everyday speech.

  In common usage, an "exhibitionist" is often equated with "show-off"... a person who goes out of their way to attract attention through their clothes, an athletic stunt, or some other form of making themselves distinct from the crowd. The element of surprise is not necessarily there, nor is there a sexual component, in the sense that a person has to have that element in order to be stimulated sexually (which is the "clinical" definition of the term as psychiatrists and psychologists use it).

  It really doesn't make any difference to the subject of the discussion, though. The question is whether nudism and exhibitionism, however you define it, are mutually exclusive, or whether they can exist as motivations at the same time. I'll argue the latter, on the grounds that exhibitionism -- the motivation that goes on inside one's head -- is essentially a private affair as long as the exhibitor doesn't manifest any outward signs of it by going out of their way to flaunt their nudity, whereas social nudism is obviously a public affair by definition. (I say "social nudism" because being nude in private doesn't even matter, unless one spends much of their private time admiring themselves in the mirror.)

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• GU

  

  Guzzi27

  Aug 4, 2021

  [quote]I have the greatest respect for the OED, and would resort to it without hesitation if I were writing an academic paper on the subject. But language has a way of slipping past the dictionary definitions, and I think that "exhibitionism" is one of those words that have taken on auxiliary meanings in everyday speech. In common usage, an "exhibitionist" is often equated with "show-off"... a person who goes out of their way to attract attention through their clothes, an athletic stunt, or some other form of making themselves distinct from the crowd. The element of surprise is not necessarily there, nor is there a sexual component, in the sense that a person has to have that element in order to be stimulated sexually (which is the "clinical" definition of the term as psychiatrists and psychologists use it). It really doesn't make any difference to the subject of the discussion, though. The question is whether nudism and exhibitionism, however you define it, are mutually exclusive, or whether they can exist as motivations at the same time. I'll argue the latter, on the grounds that exhibitionism -- the motivation that goes on inside one's head -- is essentially a private affair as long as the exhibitor doesn't manifest any outward signs of it by going out of their way to flaunt their nudity, whereas social nudism is obviously a public affair by definition. (I say "social nudism" because being nude in private doesn't even matter, unless one spends much of their private time admiring themselves in the mirror.)[/quote] Very well put.

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• FU

  

  FullSun

  Aug 7, 2021

  I agree. Way too much detail and no opinion on the topic.

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• JO

  

  John

  Aug 7, 2021

  BigDudeMan wrote: [quote]What people are forgetting when they call themselves Nudist/exhibitionists is that they are creating Nudist/victims of sexual harassment. Where will there be a safe place to just be a nudist then?[/quote] Where you aren't being a dick. I'm serious. If your definition of exhibitionism is surprising people and showing them your naked body without their consent, then you're creating victims of sexual harassment. If you enjoy being nude and being seen in public in an area like a nude beach or a nudist resort, where there is no element of surprise, and where nudity is the norm rather than the exception, then there's no reason why you can't get pleasure out of it, even a sexual one, as long as you're not going around parading your boner in front of people. If you can't understand the difference, maybe the nude scene is not for you, because you're bound to get into trouble sooner or later.

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• MA

  

  Marcus

  Aug 8, 2021

  I can only quote what I have written before:
  
  "My feeling is naturism is asexual. Of course we are conditioned from our childhood that nakedness is at least eroticism. Some take it a step further and do exhibitionism or voyeurism. Some go even further than that. My feeling is the challenge with naturism (and also the fun) is to condition nakedness with asexuality. That means also you have less erotic or sexual situations than textiles."

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• JO

  

  John

  Aug 9, 2021

  BigDudeMan wrote: [quote]Mr Woodsman, go read any one of the many erection threads on this site and tell me how many dudes here would rather act like a dick. Maybe the beach I go to is full of exhibitionists, I wouldnt know. I just mind my business read my book or listen to my tunes. Like every one else. Thats my pleasure.[/quote] Well, I agree that this site attracts quite a few people who say they like to flaunt their erections in public. I also wouldn't dispute your experience on the beaches where you like to go. But flaunting erections isn't a part of my experience with nudism, which I think is representative of mainstream nudism as I read about it and talk about it with people. And this attitude about how great it is to show your boner in public may be a reason why women aren't attracted to the lifestyle. They're looking for people they can socialize with as friends, not people who look like they're out there for sex. So any reputation nudism has for flagrant display of erections is going to be a deterrent to them. "I get hit on all the time anyway," a woman might think. "Why should I go to a place where it's so obvious? This guy wants to show me his dick, and he's staring at my boobs. I'm not going to get a meaningful relationship with a guy who thinks he's just eye candy, and thinks I'm just eye candy."

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• NI

  nirvana_mtor

  Aug 12, 2021

  I don't know for sure, but if there is overlap, I am right in there, LoL.

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• DI

  

  Ditchdoctor

  Aug 19, 2021

  My wife called me a nude introverted exibitionist! Still thinking on that one. Im nude because it feels good to be free of clothes.

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