Are the Chat Room Mods REALLY necessary?

Replies

• TH

  

  Thomas

  Apr 22, 2011

  The site owner has the ability to come into chat unseen and has done so at times.  He is in effect moderating the mods.  There is also a link to report abuse at bottom on chat page, It  can be used if you feel a mod is being unfair.
  
  While it is true that the regulars are quick to respond to their friends coming in, most also respond to newcomers and welcome them.  There are times when the chat is moving so quickly that things get missed.  That is not intentionally ignoring someone, they just missed it.
  
  I hate having to boot someone, I would much rather everyone have a good time chatting, whether new or regular.

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• ME

  Member

  Apr 22, 2011

  REFRESHER COURSE 101:http://www.truenudists.com/forum/viewthread.php?id=12506So yes, there are guidelines that we follow....

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• ME

  Member

  Apr 22, 2011

  Perhaps the real problem is that different mods have different standards. at least one appears to tackle the job with the zeal of an FBI officer without any humour.

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• ME

  Member

  Apr 22, 2011

  [quote]Check on other threads regarding the number of women who have left TN due to harrassment and sexual abuse, then ask your question again.[/quote] Yes i am often shocked at the blatant chatting up of the gals on open chat, and rarely see any such abused kicked off even when a mod is on hand. That must be the main reason so many gals leave the sire allegedley

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• ME

  Member

  Apr 22, 2011

  [quote][quote]Check on other threads regarding the number of women who have left TN due to harrassment and sexual abuse, then ask your question again.[/quote]  Yes i am often shocked at the blatant chatting up of the gals on open chat, and rarely see any such abused kicked off even when a mod is on hand. That must be the main reason so many gals leave the sire allegedley[/quote]   Actually, the "gals" who leave the site do so because of the constant harassment and unsolicited sexual advances made to them in private chats. That is why the women who chat in the open chat constantly tell people, "I'm not pm'ing talk to me in the main room." Or who have a "scrolling" message on their cam that says "NO PM's". That is the #1 complaint mods get. And the #1 reason people get kicked out of chat, for sexually harassing women (and other men) in pm's. 2nd on that list are people who masturbate on cam. 3rd on that list are those who need constant reminder's and warnings - day in and day out - that faces need to be on cam. 4th on that list would be those who troll, make random inflammatory statements and purposely provoke arguments with the mods and other users.   Unless one is actually masturbating on cam or is sexually or otherwise harassing ANY member in a pm (either of those will elicit an IMMEDIATE kick - no warnings), any member who has been kicked out of chat has been given mulitple warnings, often by multiple mods.  If they choose to ignore those warnings or choose to consider those warnings to be "threats", that is their choice. To feign surprise, ignorance or indignation after multiple warnings, when one finally does get kicked, is also quite common.   Kicks are not limited to men abusing the chat room.  Although less common, there are women who abuse the chat room as well.  They, too, get kicked.   Yes, the mods have guidelines which they follow as closely as possible.  And, contrary to the belief of some, mods don't like kicking people out.  Actually we really dislike it when it becomes necessary.  And we don't like the notification in red letters that occurs in the new, upgraded room.  It is a distraction and interruption of the normal chat flow. When someone is kicked out, there is documentation of why the kick occured, should it ever come up for question with TT1 (the site owner).  If any one feels that any mod has been abusive, there is a contact button at the bottom of every page.   Mods are also human. Mistakes happen. But considering the number of cams we keep an eye on, chat flow we pay attention to and pm's that we respond to (sometimes as many as 10 at a time), those mistakes happen rarely.  When a mistake is made, we are the first to admit to it, apologize to the person it happened to, apologize in the public room when it is warranted, send messages to TT1 letting him know a mistake was made and still get slammed for it and have it held against us.   But back to the OP's original question, are mods necessary? Yes. Because too many users are incapable or unwilling to follow what amounts to 6 very simple rules that they AGREE to before entering the chat room: 1. No Sexual Discussion, or Sexual Activities on Chat 2. No Crotch Shots. Faces on cam please. 3. If you do not want to be seen on your cam. Do not use it. Your cam is visible to all users. (or use the block feature, these rules were written before that feature was available) 4.  Please talk nice. No trolling. 5.  Flag users who do not follow the rules. (or report them to a mod, these rules were written before mods were implemented) 6. Have Fun!   Jen

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• PE

  

  PeaceMaleOriginal Poster

  Apr 22, 2011

  Gosh , the above responses were truly eye opening.  Here is what I know: I am not a "perv", nor do I appreciate any implication that I am (nakedspark). I object to mods because in thehundredsof times that I have been in the chat room, I can counton one handthe amount of times someone was truly unruly.  Perhaps I am giving this community too much credit, or perhaps the rest arent giving this community enough credit. I was booted simply because I commented on someone being booted (which I agree with the poster who suggested that minimally this action should not be broadcasted).  But Tx, my chat room exchange was hardly "inflammatory".  It became aggressive when I asked the mod not to threaten (to boot) me, and then I was booted. I guess the mod didnt have to take my "crap", afterall the rules are the rules, and besides that mod had a ZAP button. It is that verylack ofdiscretionthat beckons your attention. Here is what I've learned: There are plenty of members on here that have genuine disdain for plenty of members on here. One member even compared a mod to a "parachute". The last time I checked, one saves lives - but boy, what a truly telling statement. I would submit to you that mods operate more like hall monitors (not parachutes).  While they are empowered to keep order in the halls, lets face it ..  they are generally more interested in making sure you have your hall pass than truly adding a more effective layer of security other than that which is already in place.  For example: With regard to male members making unsolcited advances to a woman, can't that woman simply BLOCK that user?  If it happens too often, arent you able to turn off the ability to receive PM's? (if not, note to site owner).  With regard to masturbation on cams, thats gross  - but as I said earlier - I wont watch the cam (i have that choice). Umm, I am not sure I understand the face on cam rule, seems dumb if the guy isnt doing anything lude - but heck that a different topic all together.  Wth regards to trolling, wow, other than my complaining about the mods, how much of this eggregious behavior actually occurs?

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• TH

  

  Thomas

  Apr 22, 2011

  Peacemale, the inflamatory comments I was talking about were not from your recent boot, they were made several months ago.  They were directed at me even though I was not the one who had booted your friend earlier.  Your comments led others to attack me simply because I was a mod.
  
  There is option to block PMs, just not all know how to use it.  Another problem is sometimes they occur so fast a person gets flustered by them.
  
  As I stated previously, if someone had to keep blocking people because of rude remarks, it takes away from the pleasure of coming to chat and they will leave.
  
  As far as the face on cam rule, when you talk to someone in person, do you look at their face or at their crotch?  The rules for chat are simply a restatement of proper social behaviour.  I would venture to say that if someone behaved at a resort the way they behave in chat, those that get booted from chat would be banned from ever returning to that resort and possibly any resort if they behaved that way at a resort.

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• ME

  Member

  Apr 22, 2011

  Tx, the last time I was in chat the PMs came in so fast that it bogged down the window, made everything start blinking - totally wigged the system out several times; I wasn't able to finish the one conversation Ihadstarted and I couldn't even gettoany of the controls to set them to "no PMs"....  I finally had to just dump out of the chat room altogether, and I haven't been back since...

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• TH

  

  Thomas

  Apr 22, 2011

  [quote]Tx, the last time I was in chat the PMs came in so fast that it bogged down the window, made everything start blinking - totally wigged the system out several times; I wasn't able to finish the one conversation Ihadstarted and I couldn't even gettoany of the controls to set them to "no PMs"....  I finally had to just dump out of the chat room altogether, and I haven't been back since...[/quote]  I am sorry that that happened, it just proved my point.  I don't know why some can't get it through their heads that that kind of action drives people away.  Some people disable PMs as soon as they come into room, hopefully before they are noticed if that helps any.  Would love to see you back in chat.

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• DA

  DanandJanette

  Apr 22, 2011

  [quote]Tx, the last time I was in chat the PMs came in so fast that it bogged down the window, made everything start blinking - totally wigged the system out several times; I wasn't able to finish the one conversation Ihadstarted and I couldn't even gettoany of the controls to set them to "no PMs"....  I finally had to just dump out of the chat room altogether, and I haven't been back since...[/quote]  You have to laugh at these losers who can't interact with women face to face, and have to resort to harassing them over the internet. I'm certainly not every woman's dream guy, but my God, it's so easy to strike up a respectful conversation in person. These guys must all be social misfits.

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• PE

  

  PeaceMaleOriginal Poster

  Apr 23, 2011

  Tx, I remember getting angry with the idea of mods, and "attacking
  you". And you handled it the way a quality mod would - with a logical
  response and I appreciated it.  You didnt BOOT me, nor did you threaten
  to, as you used proper discretion.

  With regards to crotch shots, I agree
  that those should not be allowed on a "stand alone" basis. I was
  referring to someone like myself who used to not show face, nor crotch
  (see my main image).  Ya see, I like being nude - socially - but not
  necessarily broadcasting on the internet.  So I used to cheat a little
  by broadcasting some, but not all of me.  Nothing lude. Yet to use my
  previous analogy, the "hall monitors" would ask to see my "hall pass" -
  because those are the rules (which in that instance served no purpose).
  In
  regards to turning PM's off, perhaps instead of having only rules
  posted prior to entering the chat room, you might reinforce that members
  have the right and ability to block all PM's, and to not watch any cam
  they are not comfortable watching. PM's will happen.  And you can hardly
  blame a guy for PMing another member - I dont belive the previous
  poster indicated that these PM's were out-of-line (and its unfair to
  assume they were), just that there were too many.
  I may also
  mention to the other members that their disdain for the "losers" that
  cant speak to women except for the internet make no sense as applied to
  this site. At any given time, there is less than 5% of chat room users
  who are women (so if you are joining the chat room, there is a good
  chance you have come to chat with men).
  Lastly, for what its
  worth, I am also a member of another site, I will NOT mention the site
  name, with a smaller population of mostly women - and some men.  No
  mods, and a terrifically supportive and respecting community of adults.
  Perhaps this is why I get frustrated with the uninformed and accusatrory
  assertions of some members of this site who believe nirvana is achieved
  with a firm policing against anyone with a varying view - be it a
  "perverted" one or not.
  The site already contains all the
  tools you need to promote a quality supportive online community - it
  does not need the presence of moderators to further impede the progress
  of this developing community.

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• PE

  

  PeaceMaleOriginal Poster

  Apr 23, 2011

  pa: sorry for my terrible formatting.  It seems it takes me too long to type my response, and I lose my sign-in.  When I repost the copied version, the format goes whacky.  I try to edit , but no use.

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• ME

  Member

  Apr 23, 2011

  Peace - The few times I have been to chat I have always gotten a lot of requests for private contact info, to go on cam to Yahoo, and quite frequent veering into inappropriate subject content......  There are a lot of trolls hanging out there, as well as a lot of nice people....

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• PE

  

  PeaceMaleOriginal Poster

  Apr 23, 2011

  Cear, my guess is that its because you are one of the few attractive women, or just one of the few women, in the chat room - do the math.   If unwanted, just block all PM's.  That way you can still engage in the chat room discussion.  Oh, but you wont be able to send any PM's - but doesnt seem like you have a need for that anyhow, so you should be ok.

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• TH

  

  Thomas

  Apr 23, 2011

  [quote]Cear, my guess is that its because you are one of the few attractive women, or just one of the few women, in the chat room - do the math.   If unwanted, just block all PM's.  That way you can still engage in the chat room discussion.  Oh, but you wont be able to send any PM's - but doesnt seem like you have a need for that anyhow, so you should be ok.[/quote]    Turning off private messages is only for recieving.  You can still send PMs.  Also even if you have them turned off, a moderator can still send you a message.  This is usefull because a moderator can still send a warning to someone even if they are not paying attention to the chat room.

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• PE

  

  PeaceMaleOriginal Poster

  Apr 23, 2011

  [quote] Turning off private messages is only for recieving.  You can still send PMs.  Also even if you have them turned off, a moderator can still send you a message.  This is usefull because a moderator can still send a warning to someone even if they are not paying attention to the chat room.  [/quote] Even better !  Thanks Tx.

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• ME

  Member

  Apr 23, 2011

  [quote]Yes, I was kicked out because I objected to them being there[/quote]     Peacemale, to protect each member’s privacy, the moderators have a policy of not discussing why any one has been kicked out of chat, other than the affected member, another mod or the site owner. This has been explained to you EVERY time you have questioned a mod as to why a particular member was kicked.  As you have seen fit to make your “kick” a public issue, I will respond to you in kind.   You were not kicked out because you “objected to them being there”, you were kicked out after you continued to argue in a pm with a mod (snugglebunny) after you were asked to stop arguing and given a warning about trolling. [quote]- apparantly you are not allowed to reference the super-users in the chat as it impededs the flow of what is otherwise thought to be engaging conversation. [/quote]     You can reference mods all you want.  That is not what you were doing.  You were on a tirade, making antagonistic statements designed to illicit an argument, which interrupted the flow of chat. Question us (the mods) all you want. Many do with the intent to have intelligent conversation and we all learn from each other that way.  But making snide, derogatory, insulting or inflammatory statements about any member – whether they are a mod or not – is not conversation, it is trolling. [quote]I was given a first and "final warning" and was kicked out after telling the moderator to please refrain from threatening me as it wasnt very nice.[/quote]     This was NOT your first warning.  Approx. 7 months ago, in open chat, you repeatedly asked me (Jen) why I had kicked someone out, even after  I explained to you that to protect their privacy I would not discuss with you why someone is kicked.  I warned you then to stop trolling, several times, before you left the room of your own volition. Several months ago you argued with me (Jen) for 20 minutes (from 8:19am – to 8:39am) regarding a rule you disagreed with.  After patiently explaining to you over and over again that I did not make the rules, I asked you and warned you repeatedly to contact the site owner if you had any issues with any of the chat rules and to stop hassling me over a rule I did not make and could not change. I can guarantee that the last time you ran into Tx, he warned you at least once, to stop trolling.  Last night, in open chat, you made inflammatory, argumentative and insulting remarks (trolling) in response to a mod (Snugglebunny – my husband this time) kicking someone out of chat.  When he pm’d you to find out what “your issue” was, you continued to make insulting and derogatory remarks. You were not “threatened”, you were politely warned:  “Please stop arguing with me about this, this is your final warning…”    He gave you a final warning to stop, which you chose to ignore.  When you continued to troll, he kicked you out.  Over a 6-7 month period you have received one warning after another, after another. This was NOT your first warning. If you feel you were kicked out of chat unfairly, you can  send an email toabuse@truenudists.com. We will gladly provide the full chat history and documentation of every run in we’ve had with you to the site owner. [quote]Look, I dont deny that there are "perverts" out there, but do object  to the use of the term.  For example, most of the people I know would deem anyone logged into this site as a "pervert", so we ought to be a little more sensitive when throwing that term around.  But I digress.  I get back to my initial point - this site is equipped with tools to remedy disruptive behavior, we cant have the hyper-sensitivities (and inability to self remedy) of a few members dictate the need for a regulatory body, unless of course you wish to promote a community that perpetuates conventional societal "norms" , the very norms we challenge, and of which lead us here in the first place. [/quote]     We do not challenge societal norms, other than the norm of wearing clothing.  This is a social nudist site where socially accepted mores and tenets are expected.  These expectations are set by the owner of this site.  Moderators were implemented because the site owner deemed it necessary for his chat room to be maintained the way he wanted it to be.  He deemed it necessary because of all the complaints received regarding members who were incapable or unwilling to follow the 6 simple rules he asks EVERYONE to agree to before entering the chat room. If you doubt where the site owner stands on this issue please see, among many others:His profile- note his interests3000 Users– his blogThis forum thread– approved by the site ownerThis forum thread– written by the site owner   Jen

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• PE

  

  PeteyB

  Apr 24, 2011

  I just wonder why you felt the need to argue with the guy for 20  minutes?. A person acts as you say he was acting there is no need to even respond to after the warning . I  personally would have ignored the nonsense after the warning and see what his reaction would have been.. If he was still offensive after the warning then a swift boot without any explanation further. He knew why you booted him. Why allow that to continue for 20 minutes? I think you are part of what kept him going for 20 minutes.  The behavior he displayed.. if it was as you say was that of a child. There is no benefit to arguing with a child for 20 minutes as to the discipline you gave.
  
  This is a prime example of the need for training of the moderators here. For a moderator to argue with a customer to the site for 20 minutes seems to be the kind of reaction I am talking about the moderators display here. Like there is a need to autonomous rule and you WILL obey or pay the consequences.  If someone came into your retail store would you stand there and argue with them for 20 minutes?.

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• RE

  

  renebbare

  Apr 24, 2011

  Can I say I commend any mod who is willing to spend "20mins" of their free time to try and argue the point of true nudism.
  And my "20 mins" reading here and writting this would probably have been better spent in chat with friends rather than here trying to educate 'some' others on why Chat Room Mods are Really necessary.
  Lastly I agree there is a sore need for training here and that way we will not need the Mods!

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• PE

  

  PeaceMaleOriginal Poster

  Apr 24, 2011

  Jen -  I know you wouldnt want to do this, but feel free to print the
  exchange in which, according to your husband I was making "inflammatory,
  argumentative and insulting remarks". My recollection (and admittedely
  it was late), was that I made a comment about yet another person being
  kicked out.. and then toungue firmly in cheek, I asked wheteher someone
  else in the room could be kicked out for repeatedly posting count styled
  numbers .. ala , 1, 2, 3 - etc.  Your husband then PM'd me saying that I
  have been told in the past to in effect cut it out, and that it was my
  final warning.  I responded exactly as I said i did, "please dont
  threaten me, its not very nice". And then, POOF.
  As for the
  other posters who have suggested that if I dont like it here then "I can
  leave", I cant think of a more narrowed response to my inquiry.  Shame
  on you. This forum exists for a reason, and if you dont like the fact
  that I have used this forum to pose this inquiry, then perhaps YOU can
  leave.

  The irony in all of this is that I am a relatively passive
  and conservative individual. I was drawn to this site as it represented
  what I thought was a harmonious community of like-minded individulas. I
  even selected a screen name that I thought would capture my optimism
  and general outlook. What I have found is that human nature is in effect
  human nature.  That there are folks on here that are just plain
  judgemental, intolerant, and at times  mean-spirited.   Jen I am not
  referring to you or your husband, I dont actually have any beef to pick
  with either of you , or any of the mods.  It is not the individual mods i
  object to, but rather the notion of instituting a process of
  enforcement which may have the unintended consequences of alienating, or
  worse yet, excluding, what would otherwise be productive members of
  this community.
  Like me, for example.

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• ME

  Member

  Apr 24, 2011

  [quote]I just wonder why you felt the need to argue with the guy for 20  minutes?. A person acts as you say he was acting there is no need to even respond to after the warning . I  personally would have ignored the nonsense after the warning and see what his reaction would have been.. If he was still offensive after the warning then a swift boot without any explanation further. He knew why you booted him. Why allow that to continue for 20 minutes? I think you are part of what kept him going for 20 minutes.  The behavior he displayed.. if it was as you say was that of a child. There is no benefit to arguing with a child for 20 minutes as to the discipline you gave.    This is a prime example of the need for training of the moderators here. For a moderator to argue with a customer to the site for 20 minutes seems to be the kind of reaction I am talking about the moderators display here. Like there is a need to autonomous rule and you WILL obey or pay the consequences.  If someone came into your retail store would you stand there and argue with them for 20 minutes?. [/quote]     Petey, unless it's a serious violation (sexual activity on cam, harassment, threats) all the mods try to answer all questions as patiently as possible. Often times (as was the case that day) we are dealing with multiple pm's dealing with various issues - from answering questions about how the chat room works, giving technical advice, fielding complaints about other members, asking people to comply with chat rules, issuing warnings, etc.  Along with this we are keeping an eye on the room chat flow, checking cams and bouncing between two rooms.  How could it go on for 20 minutes? Easy, his pm was not the only one I was dealing with.  Why didn't I just boot him to begin with?  Because, unless there is a serious violation, or a constant repetition of a minor violation mods do NOT want to boot people. And he wasn't booted in that instance.  He was given warnings to stop trolling. Why didn't I feel it warranted a boot? Because it wasn't interrupting the flow of chat, it was being dealt with in a private pm. His actually boot occured after the fourth instance (that I know of) of being warned by mods.  And his response to that was to start this thread.   To answer your question in regards to a retail store, yes, I would have done EXACTLY the same thing - explain the store policies, patiently listen to the complaints of the patron, offer a solution, direct them to the person in charge if I could not satisy them and finally, when all else fails, direct them to a store that might better suit there needs.  And the chances are good, especially if I had other customers I was dealing with, that this exchange would also take about 20 minutes.   I am having a difficult time understanding you.  On one post you complain that the mods are over zealous, that you experienced an accidental kick from an "over zealous" mod.  That even though the mod admitted that a mistake had been made and apologized that you were still angry. As a mod, I can tell you that "quick to hit the button" is not an indication of an over zealous mod - it is a reference to the way the room list will "jump" when someone enters or leaves the room.  There are instances when a mod is in the process of kicking someone out and the room list jumps to the next name.  This is a rare occurance, but it does happen.  As it sounds it did to you.    Now, when an example is being shown of the patience of mods NOT being quick to kick someone, NOT being over zealous you are suggesting that they should have been quicker on the boot?   You also mentioned on a previous post that you are a "customer here" and that you don't  "feel as if you had been served properly".  No you are not a "customer".  A customer is one who purchases goods or services from another. You are a nonpaying member of a social website that offers a FREE chat room to all members.   Hope this helps to clarify certain issues for you and give you a better understanding of what the (volunteer) chat room mods do on a daily basis to help make this a better site!     Jen

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• PE

  

  PeaceMaleOriginal Poster

  Apr 24, 2011

  Good point Jen !  Petey all you have to do to achieve "paying customer" status is commit $45 (US) using a B-rated credit card processing company (no one has actually ever heard of) , and vioala ! .. The right to be treated as a paying member.

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• TH

  

  Thomas

  Apr 24, 2011

  Another great post Jen.  I also try to politely explain things.  It is very true that it can get hectic at times.  I have had things occur that I almost missed due to high activity in room and in PMs.  We are human after all.
  Thomas

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• DA

  DanandJanette

  Apr 24, 2011

  Jen, 20 minutes of PM exchanges to try and reason with someone being unreasonable is far and away beyond my own personal capabilities. And that's meant only as a compliment. You're infinitly more patient than am I.
  Tx, after reading your many posts in multiple threads, and in the few times I've been in chat, I sincerely regret we don't live close enough to meet in person. You sound like someone of true quality of character. In fact, I'm sure my wife and I would also love to be able to meet Jen and Steve in person as well.......they sound like so many other wonderful couples we've met in various nudist camps in the past. When you see reasonable debate and discourse come shining through in writing, you know there is a quality person on the other end. This isn't meant to be condescending in any way, but such interactions encourage me to be a better person. Hope you all have a great Easter Sunday.

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