ME
MemberOriginal Poster
May 16, 2012Well it's been an interesting ride, at first we were accepted into their "Trusted Website" program.
Our application was approved and we were provided the "Trusted Seal". After just a few days of a few of the "trustees of the board" complained and required us to remove it. I know that one of our smaller competitors is friends with a lot of the people in AANR and in my opinion believe this may have influenced this decision.
I was denied a reason for the dismissal and even a contact to discuss the matter with, until I threatened to notify my user base about the dismissal. I was contacted today by Jim Smock, AANR Executive Director, who told me the reason for the dismissal was because there were some pictures that he found that could be construed as provacative. There is always a challenge to keep the site clean, and I believe we do a pretty good job at moderating and removing these pictures, but without completely removing the pictures it's not possible to notice every misplaced hand. That said, I was happy to have at least been acknowledged and given a reason for the dismissal.
The problem that haunts me after this, is not that our site does not conform to AANR's definition of nudism. It's that sites that face the same issues as us are allowed. It seems rather fishy to me that my competitors who have the same difficulty as us in moderating pictures are allowed into the "Trusted Website" program. Our site has the most advanced moderation techniques, every single picture is seen by a moderator, and users have the ability to flag anything that sneaks through, our competitors do not. When I asked how this was possible, I was told it was not something that could be discussed. I'm not going to persue this any further. We've already been denied a chance to advertise with AANR in January, now the trusted website fees, and they've already lost these 2 members, I hope that the money that they're turning down is for the right reason, and not just a friendly favor to our competitor.
What are your thoughts on the matter?
Our application was approved and we were provided the "Trusted Seal". After just a few days of a few of the "trustees of the board" complained and required us to remove it. I know that one of our smaller competitors is friends with a lot of the people in AANR and in my opinion believe this may have influenced this decision.
I was denied a reason for the dismissal and even a contact to discuss the matter with, until I threatened to notify my user base about the dismissal. I was contacted today by Jim Smock, AANR Executive Director, who told me the reason for the dismissal was because there were some pictures that he found that could be construed as provacative. There is always a challenge to keep the site clean, and I believe we do a pretty good job at moderating and removing these pictures, but without completely removing the pictures it's not possible to notice every misplaced hand. That said, I was happy to have at least been acknowledged and given a reason for the dismissal.
The problem that haunts me after this, is not that our site does not conform to AANR's definition of nudism. It's that sites that face the same issues as us are allowed. It seems rather fishy to me that my competitors who have the same difficulty as us in moderating pictures are allowed into the "Trusted Website" program. Our site has the most advanced moderation techniques, every single picture is seen by a moderator, and users have the ability to flag anything that sneaks through, our competitors do not. When I asked how this was possible, I was told it was not something that could be discussed. I'm not going to persue this any further. We've already been denied a chance to advertise with AANR in January, now the trusted website fees, and they've already lost these 2 members, I hope that the money that they're turning down is for the right reason, and not just a friendly favor to our competitor.
What are your thoughts on the matter?
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Replies
- DR
DrewMay 17, 2012This thread leads into an interesting underlying question on the modern relevance of AANR philosophy, in general: In this age of greater tolerance, self expression, and personal freedom, why would AANR be in decline among younger generations? How can it be that Americans raised in the 40s/50s/60s are *more* inclined towards nudism vs. those of brought up in the more socially liberal 70s/80s/90s?
Politically incorrect speculation: Is it possible the AANR / TN premise of natural enjoyment of 100% asexual nudity was never as broad or pure as indicated? That for many visitors to traditional nudist venues/websites -- I'm not saying all, for those of you "true" nudists -- there's been a titillating element of voyerism or exhibitionism, whether it's visibly apparent or not?
In other words, since the Internet makes life easier for voyeurs and exhibitionists to have their fun outside nudist venues, that could explain a lot of AANR participation diminishing. Splitting TS out from TN was a fine idea, and while I don't know if TS has become a more active site than TN, if so that could be a proof point for this theory.
Fwiw, I've also thought the label "swingers" pulls the pendulum too far the other direction, i.e. exhibitionism isn't inherently "swinging". Those who've see me on TS know I'm not AANR-minded by a long shot, but in getting to know people on both TN and TS, there are a lot of us who enjoy a middle ground lifestyle between being rigidly non-sexual and public orgies. Many younger guys tell me they go nude at home and want to try social nudism, but
fear the erection ban, despite that experienced nudist standby to
"just roll over" or "cover with a towel". (Ironically, I've also heard from many women (and men) who say they have no issue seeing hardons.)
Again, none of this is to argue either AANR or TN are too restrictive, rather just food for thought whether younger generations simply see the sexual taboos of traditional nudism as outdated, relative to the new openness of the Internet era. (Lastly another factor I suspect explains declining nudism is that so many young Americans are now overweight and obese, they're ashamed of how they look naked, but that's a complex topic for another forum.)
I look forward to hearing others' perspectives. :)ReactReply - MEMemberMay 17, 2012As a newbie to the world of organized social nudity, I did not join TN (certified and paid, within the first 3 days) because of an AANR logo.
I joined on the recommendation of a trusted friend. His opinion means more to me than any number of "Trusted site" seals of of approval.
Just my .05 cents worth (inflation, don't ya know), your mileage may vary.ReactReply - RE
renebbareMay 17, 2012There do seem to be some incongruences from TT1, with regard to "provocative" photos.
The two statements "I believe we do a pretty good job at moderating and removing these pictures" and "Our site has the most advanced moderation techniques, every single picture is seen by a moderator, and users have the ability to flag anything that sneaks through". One seems to fly in the face of the other? If as stated they have been seen by a moderator, why were they allowed? It is a fact, that so many photos here are in breach of the rules and yes many of those are flagrant breach's, that members have slowed and some stopped flagging at all. There is little point in flagging all but blatant erections it seems.
Clearly from the 1st statement Tn could do better and in my opinion, it matters not what our competition does. We are here for Truenudists! lets stop the bitching and look at ways to improve our site.
And as I have said before - when it does improve, I shall again become a paid member.ReactReply - NA
nakkidMay 17, 2012I think Drew Sea has one of the best points. It seems silly to me that an organization that already supports the "free" lifestyle of nudity would have a problem with others being more free than they. No wonder the younger generation doesn't want to be a part of the "nudist" lifestyle. There's too much petty bickering and not enough enjoyment of the freedom that should come with nudity. I didn't join this site because of AANR, and I certainly won't leave because of their rejection. However, as one who enjoys nudity and the FREEDOM that comes with it, or should come with it, can i ask that we not have prudish policing in amongst those who have already chosen what society calls a "deviant" lifestyle? As nudists we're already considered different, so let's unite and celebrate how each of us views living nude differently - respecting those differences but not judging each other for them - instead of attacking one another.
ReactReply - RErenebbareMay 17, 2012The 'freedoms' that we enjoy only extend to clothing we are nudists not libertines!
Sex on our beaches or indeed in any public place alienates us to the extent that we will lose the very 'freedom' we are seeking.ReactReply - OR
orbarebearMay 17, 2012I guess I don't go browsing the pictures that much, but I have yet to see anything particularly blatant.
ReactReply - WE
westheathenMay 18, 2012Really the only way that I can see of clearing the site of dubious photos is to delete the lot and start again; with each upload being checked before being published. Although it would be an immense amount of work I can think of no other way, with the site set as it is with large amounts of photos unviewable by anyone except the TTs.ReactReply - MEMemberMay 18, 2012I really am not surprised that it has gone. This site has so many flaws that its unbelievable.
I have had pictures deleted that are deemed inappropriate, when they are not, yet, I can point anyone to a number of profiles where guys are stood there with a full on boner. I am not offended by an erection, probably as I am a bloke and also get them, but there is clearly something wrong with the people screening the pictures.
Also, if they want this site to be taken seriously, then they need to ensure that being 'Certified' means something.
There is nothing to stop a person getting certified by sending off their naked picture. Once certification has been agreed, you can delete those pictures and upload what the hell you like. So certified means what exactly? I have seen so may pictures on profiles on this site that have been taken off the internet.
I think that for those of us that have become certified, we should have those certification pictures as a permanent addition to your profile and they cannot be deleted. You can still select who sees them of course but how many people on here have a certification pictures that matches the face on the uploaded pictures?
I befriended a guy on here a while back, in his 20's, slim, great pictures. I spoke to him on webcam, he was in his late 40's at least and 5 times the size. He was certified!
Unless this site can sort out the basic securities in making sure that those that want to use it are for real and genuine, they stand little chance of being taken seriously.ReactReply - HA
HawkMay 18, 2012Brian Spence is the competitor teamtrue1 is talking about. I was a member of his other two sites some time ago and yes lack of management and site features is a big problem. I'm just glad that I discovered TN and so is the reason I closed my accounts with Brian Spence sites. Keep up the good work TN, so far still the best nudist site in town.
ReactReply - CD
Cheri Donna DawsonMay 18, 2012[quote]Alexa rank for TN = 72,000Alexa rank for AANR = 419,000
What's that tell you? The AANR perceive TrueNudists as a threat to their business and they don't want to promote, which is basically what their "Trusted" program is all about... you pay them $100 and they lend some of their credibility to you, but really, they have fewer visitors to their website than TrueNudists, so who needs who more?
[/quote]
AANR is an organization, TN is a social networking site for nudists. Not even equal. AANR does NOT feel threatened by an online site at all. I am a member of a variety of AANR programs as well as NOVA of TNS.
The trusted program IMHO is an interesting program to gain funds. If I had the available funds, I might have gotten that as well. The Good Housekeeping Seal is possibly the equivalent.ReactReply - MEMemberMay 18, 2012[quote]I find it quite interesting that you are upset that they didn't reply to your messages. I have sent you a few and haven't heard from you either. I am saying this publically, because you haven't responded privately. [/quote]ReactReply
- CDCheri Donna DawsonMay 18, 2012[quote]So, Cheri,
I am not sure of your position as it relates to AANR rejecting TN.
Do you think they were right to pull the approval without an effort to resolve the differences?
Do you think there is political motivations regarding this Spence guy?
I see your point regarding the TS site-that it doesn't look good, but it is a fairly prominent and clear avenue to redirect swingers from TN so that we have our site and they have theirs. While I'm sure that the TT's also saw it as a business opportunity, it seems to me that the motivation was initially to keep this site clean. I understand that some, including you, would not have taken that path; and that is fine, but do you think that TN is not cleaner than it was when the swingers were here? Doesn't the existence of TS provide for an opportunity to distinguish nudism from swinging?[/quote]The same way if any affiliation is severed such as when Sunnyrest lost its AANR affiliation but when it cleaned up its act was reinstated.
No political motivations IMHO but I've not as yet evolved to reading minds. :) He wants to promote nudism in the way that it should be promoted. I believe that's his motivation alone.
TS people are still here as are others who are less than what we want here. There was a thread that stated that they were not being tossed off here, but there was an option. If the profiles flagged were viewed and then acted upon in short order, it would make this site a whole lot better.ReactReply - TE
TeamTrue2May 18, 2012[quote] Who are the photo monitors? How many of them are there and how are they chosen?[/quote]The only photo monitors are Teamtrue1 and I, Teamtrue2. Teamtrue1 is the owner of the site. I am his wife. They have to abide by the rules TN enforces. Seeing as we now have over 100,000 users we added the flag feature to get users to help. There are old photos which were grandfathered in, and these can also be flagged if deemed inappropriate. With the hundreds of photos that we receive daily one or two may slip through our eyes. We really appreciate that our users help flag. You guys are amazing and do a great job at keeping the site clean. We appreciate it.ReactReply - RU
rusty62May 18, 2012I compliment this site for the changes especially the pictures and in the chat room. Used to be we had the crotch shots appearing without looking for them. Now i don't doubt they are getting on, then I don't go looking where as an AANR official may go digging up dirt for their own protection. AANR has had its hands full keeping out of trouble and folks like my partner who loves our lifestyle will not participate here because of the past chance of perverted or harassing issues. If she once come online and seen a AANR logo here she would have some questions for our local AANR executive. She is on protecting integrity of nude lifestyle as many are - "one bad and your out". AANR - I agree has their own online interests. We may have to live with our past here in the future.ReactReply - MEMemberMay 19, 2012[quote]Well it's been an interesting ride, at first we were accepted into their "Trusted Website" program.
Our application was approved and we were provided the "Trusted Seal". After just a few days of a few of the "trustees of the board" complained and required us to remove it. I know that one of our smaller competitors is friends with a lot of the people in AANR and in my opinion believe this may have influenced this decision.
I was denied a reason for the dismissal and even a contact to discuss the matter with, until I threatened to notify my user base about the dismissal. I was contacted today by Jim Smock, AANR Executive Director, who told me the reason for the dismissal was because there were some pictures that he found that could be construed as provacative. There is always a challenge to keep the site clean, and I believe we do a pretty good job at moderating and removing these pictures, but without completely removing the pictures it's not possible to notice every misplaced hand. That said, I was happy to have at least been acknowledged and given a reason for the dismissal.
The problem that haunts me after this, is not that our site does not conform to AANR's definition of nudism. It's that sites that face the same issues as us are allowed. It seems rather fishy to me that my competitors who have the same difficulty as us in moderating pictures are allowed into the "Trusted Website" program. Our site has the most advanced moderation techniques, every single picture is seen by a moderator, and users have the ability to flag anything that sneaks through, our competitors do not. When I asked how this was possible, I was told it was not something that could be discussed. I'm not going to persue this any further. We've already been denied a chance to advertise with AANR in January, now the trusted website fees, and they've already lost these 2 members, I hope that the money that they're turning down is for the right reason, and not just a friendly favor to our competitor.
What are your thoughts on the matter?
[/quote]ReactReply - MEMemberMay 19, 2012If I was AANR, I wouldn't allow this site anywhere near my organization. This site is overflowing with fakes and porn. If the admins of TN would make just a small effort to make this site what it's supposed to be, they would probably get the blessings of AANR.ReactReply
- MI
MitchMay 19, 2012I think there should be a limit on the number of photos too. Who needs 1000+ pics, heck who needs 100??
Maybe we as a group should go in and make a day of flagging inappropriate pics that slip through the cracks? But then, what prevents that pic from being re-uploaded and slipping in again? hmmm.ReactReply - CO
Curt, or CowboyMay 19, 2012[quote] Not all things would be "cost effective", however, something are far more important then money. There are a few things that could be done that would be of a small cost. Most resorts have dances on sat nites, would love to see a young persons dance on some nites, maybe on Friday nites. Make it age restrictive, 30 and under. Maybe during slow times resorts could have young person days, Free to anyone under 30. I think nudists who go to the resorts could deal with either of those ideas. [/quote] I have personally suggested exactly that at more than one place, ( knowing that it excludes me ) and been met with apathy at best, and active opposition at worst.
Needless to say, nothing came of it in any case.
Does not bode well. ( IMHO )ReactReply - EV
EvansBetterHalfMay 19, 2012[quote]I see the AANR trusted seal in the lower right hand corner of this page at this moment. Does this mean the site as been reinstated or is TT1 refusing to remove it? In any case.. What does it really matter? According to TT1's tweets, the site was growing weekly well before this "Seal Of (so called) Approval". Why should you care what AANR thinks? If you like the site, stay and tell your friends about it. If not? Then do what you think is best. Don't let any organization tell you what to do.[/quote]
The seal is loading from your cache files.ReactReply - MA
MarkMay 19, 2012Bump
ReactReply - RErenebbareMay 23, 2012[quote]the mods are going over to the swingers site an doing the same a person would be kicked off this for doing[/quote]This is the Truenudists site, what goes on there has little to do with Nudism. We follow the rules set here.ReactReply
- MA
ManOfWicklowMay 24, 2012[img src="http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_l0m685v6Nr1qzxzwwo1_500.jpg">
ReactReply - MIMitchAug 28, 2012Can you just reapply? Maybe by now they will have forgotten whatever reason they may have had for denying in the first place.
Stay naked!ReactReply - T=
Tom === Thomas S. TierneyFeb 7, 2014Why are so many Religions competing. We all support the same thing - faith. Wouldn't it make sense for all of us to team up and merge as one major Religion?ReactReply